Will County Board Land Use & Development Committee met July 11.
Here are the minutes provided by the committee:
I. CALL TO ORDER AND DECLARATION OF QUORUM
Chair Frankie Pretzel called the meeting to order at 10:33 AM
| Attendee Name | Title | Status | Arrived |
| Frankie Pretzel | Chair | Present | |
| Natalie Coleman | Vice-Chair | Absent | |
| Katie Deane-Schlottman | Member | Present | |
| Sherry Newquist | Member | Present | |
| Destinee Ortiz | Member | Present | |
| Julie Berkowicz | District 10 (R - Naperville) | Present | |
| Raquel M. Mitchell | District 9 (R - Bolingbrook) | Absent |
A quorum was declared.
Staff present from the Land Use Department were David Dubois, Brain Radner, Colin Duesing, Marguerite Kenny, Adrian Diaz, Dawn Tomzcak and Nick Rodriquez. Present from the State's Attorney Office was Scott Pyles.
II. PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE
The Pledge of Allegiance was led by Destinee Ortiz.
III. APPROVAL OF MINUTES
1. WC Land Use & Development Committee - Regular Meeting - Jun 13, 2023 10:30 AM
Motion to Approve Minutes of June 13, 2023
Will County Land Use Development Committee approved by roll call vote with amendments, unanimously, 5-0.
| RESULT: APPROVED [UNANIMOUS]
MOVER: Sherry Newquist, Member SECONDER: Julie Berkowicz, District 10 (R - Naperville) AYES: Pretzel, Deane-Schlottman, Newquist, Ortiz, Berkowicz ABSENT: Coleman, Mitchell |
IV. NEW BUSINESS
1. Ordinance Amending the Will County, Illinois Zoning Ordinance Adopted and Approved September 9, 1947 as Amended for Zoning Case ZC-23-023, Metropolitan Water Reclamation District of Greater Chicago, Owner of Record, Ducere LLC, Dave Nelson (100% Owner); Applicant, Requesting: (M-23-004) Zoning Map Amendment A-1 to I-1 for Part of Parcel #11-04-22-400-001-0000 (15.05); (S-23-004) Special Use Permit for Manufacturing and Industrial Services, General for PIN #11-04-22-200-007-0000 (15.04); (S-23-018) Special Use Permit for Manufacturing and Industrial Services, General for PIN #11-04-22-400-001- 0000 (15.05); (S-23-019) Special Use Permit for Manufacturing and Industrial Services, General for PIN #11-04-22-200-006-0000 (15.02); with 14 Variances (Attached Below) for PIN'S 11-04-22-400-001-0000, 11-04-22-200-007-0000, 11- 04-22-200-006-0000, 11-04-22-901-000-0000 and 11-04-22-200-015-0000, in Lockport Township, Commonly Known as 18500 9Th Street, Romeoville, IL County Board District #5 and #9 (Brian Radner)
Case Number ZC-23-023
Request(s) 1. Map Amendment A-1 to I-1 for part of parcel 11-04-22-400-001-0000 (15.05).
2. Special Use Permit for Manufacturing and Industrial Services, General for PIN 11-04-22- 200-007-0000 (15.04).
3. Special Use Permit for Manufacturing and Industrial Services, General for PIN 11-04-22- 400-001-0000 (15.05).
4. Special Use Permit for Manufacturing and Industrial Services, General for PIN 11-04-22- 200-006-0000 (15.02).
5. Variance for east side yard setback from 10 feet to 0 feet for PIN 11-04-22-200-007- 0000 (15.04).
6. Variance for fence height from 4 feet to 8 feet in the street yard setback for 11-04-22- 200-007-0000 (15.04).
7. Variance for rear yard setback from 10 feet to 0 feet for PIN 11-04-22-200-007-0000 (15.04).
8. Variance for front yard setback from 80 feet to 0 feet for PIN 11-04-22-200-007-0000 (15.04).
9. Variance for east side yard setback from 10 feet to 0 feet for PIN 11-04-22-200-006- 0000 (15.02).
10. Variance for rear yard setback from 10 feet to 0 feet for PIN 11-04-22-200-006-0000 (15.02).
11. Variance for front yard setback from 80 feet to 0 feet for PIN 11-04-22-200-006-0000 (15.02).
12. Variance for fence height from 4 feet to 8 feet in the street yard setback for PIN 11- 04-22-200-006-0000 (15.02).
13. Variance for east side yard setback from 10 feet to 0 feet for PIN 11-04-22-400-001- 0000 (15.05).
14. Variance for rear yard setback from 10 feet to 0 feet for PIN 11-04-22-400-001-0000 (15.05).
15. Variance for front yard setback from 80 feet to 0 feet for PIN 11-04-22-400-001-0000 (15.05).
16. Variance for fence height from 4 feet to 8 feet in the street yard setback for 11-04-22- 400-001-0000 (15.05).
17. Variance for fence height from 5 feet to 8 feet in the street yard setback for PIN 11- 04-22-200-015-0000 (easterly river bank parcel).
18. Variance for fence height from 7 feet to 8 feet for PIN 11-04-22-200-015-0000 (easterly river bank parcel).
Reason for Request Construction and operation of a petroleum products terminal connection pipeline to barge transportation.
WILL COUNTY PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION STAFF REPORT
Common Address 18500 9th St, Romeoville, IL 60446
PINs 11-04-22-400-001-0000, 11-04-22-200-007-0000, 11-04-22-200-006-0000, 11-04-22- 901-000-0000 and 11-04-22-200-015-0000
Parcel Size 39.15 +/- acres total.
Current Zoning/Land Use A-1 & I-1; Industrial
Applicant Information Metropolitan Water Reclamation District of Greater Chicago (owner) Ducere LLC, Dave Nelson (applicant)
Staff Report By/Date of Report Brian Radner, AICP May 30, 2023
STAFF ANALYSIS
The applicant had submitted a similar request (6223-SV2) for a portion of the same properties in this request in 2015. The Will County Board approved that request at their April 16, 2015, meeting. The special use permit and variances that were previously approved are now expired. There were significant delays in permitting with outside agencies that contributed to the expiration. The Will County Zoning Ordinance classifies the proposed transloading facility as “manufacturing and industrial services, general.” The proposed translocating facility will transfer petroleum products from pipelines to barges. There will be connections to nearby petroleum pipelines.
STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS
1. Approval of a Map Amendment A-1 to I-1 for part of parcel 11-04-22-400-001- 0000(15.05).
2. Approval of a Special Use Permit for Manufacturing and Industrial Services, General for PIN 11-04-22-200-007-0000 (15.04) with five (5) conditions:
1) The owner of this property is required to conform with all Illinois Department of Natural Resources requirements.
2) All lighting should be fully shielded fixtures that emit no light upward.
3) Only “warm-white” or filtered LEDs (CCT < 3,000 K; S/P ratio < 1.2) shall be used to minimize blue emission.
4) The facility shall use the minimum amount of lighting that is required by law.
5) During construction, wildlife-friendly plastic free erosion control blankets shall be used near wetlands and adjacent to natural areas.
3. Approval of a Special Use Permit for Manufacturing and Industrial Services, General for PIN 11-04-22-400-001-0000 (15.05) with five (5) conditions:
1) The owner of this property is required to conform with all Illinois Department of Natural Resources requirements.
2) All lighting should be fully shielded fixtures that emit no light upward.
3) Only “warm-white” or filtered LEDs (CCT < 3,000 K; S/P ratio < 1.2) shall be used to minimize blue emission.
4) The facility shall use the minimum amount of lighting that is required by law. 5) During construction, wildlife-friendly plastic free erosion control blankets shall be used near wetlands and adjacent to natural areas.
4. Approval of a Special Use Permit for Manufacturing and Industrial Services, General for PIN 11-04-22-200-006-0000 (15.02) with five (5) conditions:
1) The owner of this property is required to conform with all Illinois Department of Natural Resources requirements.
2) All lighting should be fully shielded fixtures that emit no light upward.
3) Only “warm-white” or filtered LEDs (CCT < 3,000 K; S/P ratio < 1.2) shall be used to minimize blue emission.
4) The facility shall use the minimum amount of lighting that is required by law.
5) During construction, wildlife-friendly plastic free erosion control blankets shall be used near wetlands and adjacent to natural areas.
Brian Radner staff report findings as published & distributed. Staff reports are recorded and can be found on the Will County website.
Destinee Ortiz: The first thing that I wanted to mention is that by definition and under the zoning ordinance this project I believe should be classified as I-3 because they deal with petroleum products. I noticed when I was going through the ordinances.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Brain would you like to address this?
Brain Radner: The I-3 zoning is for petroleum production, this is not a petroleum production facility it is a barge terminal and that is the reason why it is permitted in I-1. That was the same request that was approved by the County Board in 2015. I-1 zoning in the category of special use permit for manufacturing and industrial services general. So, within that category that is where it fits. I-3 is petroleum production like a refinery.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: So, does that answer your question?
Destinee Ortiz: Yes, it does.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: I know you have several go ahead.
Destinee Ortiz: I would like to put a motion on the floor to postpone this for 30 more days as we are waiting for information, we need time to review the court documents, reports and items of that sort.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: We have a motion to postpone this for another month. Is there a second...is there a second?
No response.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Sorry your motion did not pass.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Let me ask staff is there anything you would like to say to start this off before we have committee member questions?
Brain Radner: I would be happy to try to attempt to address any of the questions that the committee has. As you know this request was before you last month and at the Board hearing it was sent back to the committee for additional discussion. As far as large terminal facilities related to petroleum product to be stored and then to be placed on barges. The property is zoned I-1. The southern portion of the property is split zoned I-1 and A-1 so the map amendment portion of this request would correct that split zoning and make it all I-1 zoning. This special use permit is needed to do the type of operation that they do. That is categorized in the industrial service’s general category. The PZC at their public hearing approved all the variance requests that were needed. Those were primarily needed for (2) two reasons; (1) one given the location of the facility on the waterway in order to operate the terminal they need to have structures closer to the property line than what would normally be allowed under the zoning setback requirements. They would have to be farther back. But because they are working on the water, they need to be closer, so that was one of the variances that was requested. The other variances that were requested pertain to fencing requirements. Those are due to comply with federal regulations. Because the facility has to make sure that nobody can access it. I would be happy to answer questions is I can. I know the applicant is here and they can address any questions.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Thank you for your comments and I will invite Mr. Nelson, I know some of these questions are going to be towards you so would you mind coming up to the microphone.
Mr. Nelson: I am Dave Nelson president of Ducere, LLC.
Destinee Ortiz: This question is for staff how does Land Use notify agencies of the proposed project, is there any follow up of the notification in the process.
Brian Radner: There are a couple of ways the agencies are notified. They are notified when the case is taken in and complete once the application is complete the contact for that district is sent an email with a return receipt request to verify that the notice was received for the zoning action. There are a couple of other agencies that require additional reporting such as IDNR that one has to be completed. Will South Cook there is an application that has to be completed for their jurisdiction. So, in those cases it is sent directly to them. I did take directly with the City of Lockport about this project months ago. I had direct contact with them. And then what staff does is if we receive any communications from those agencies, we do include it in the staff report. Sometimes we do sometimes we don't. With this case IDNR did have some recommendations for when construction takes place. With the special use permits I did add in conditions that they recommended to reduce any possible negative effects of the construction once the site is developed.
Destinee Ortiz: I know you said you spoke with the City of Lockport but I did not see any communication entered into the agenda packet, why is that?
Brain Radner: The City of Lockport didn't send a direct communication as it pertains to the project, here are our zoning comments. But during the application process I did talk to the City about it.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: I actually reached out to the Mayor of Lockport yesterday about this he said although he doesn't approve it, he had (2) two Questions he wanted me to ask if you don't mind. The original plan under the canal called for a double sleeve. The current one does not. Can you address that?
Mr. Nelson: The original plan is the same. When it talks about the double sleeve, we are going to drill a tunnel underneath the canal and then put the pipelines inside the tunnel. The tunnel itself is in bedrock, limestone bedrock in that area. Essentially it is a double sleeve in the sense that you out in a pipe and then you put a steel pipe within that pipe. Nothing has change, it is the original approved project.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Then his second question is about tank storage. There was originally a plan for tank storage there it went away or something changed.
Mr. Nelson: That is not part of the current zoning case. That is separate, that part of the project may or may not be built. It is not part of this case, it is within the City of Lockport.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Member Newquist.
Sherry Newquist: Do you have any idea of the number of oil tankers, let me ask a different way, will this actually reduce the number of oil tankers traveling by railroad or will it stop that number from increasing at some point. I am just trying to get feel for how this, living in an area where we are crisscrossed by railroad tracks with tanker after tanker going through it. It is a concern to local residents. I am trying to get a feel for how this might reduces that pressure on the tankers.
Mr. Nelson: Right. That is kind of the core purpose of the project. It is not off to the side at all. Ducere, LLC. is a small company we don't control the entire oil market or anything like that. People are free to transport oil however they need that is deemed safe and legal. That said the economics of moving oil by barge are competitive with pipeline and significantly less than rail. Given the oil business is generally driven by economics it should reduce dramatically. When you look back over the last ten plus years we have gone to points of, it went from almost no oil by rail frankly ten plus years ago. The US is bringing right around 400 thousand barrels a day of oil from Canada by railcar. Kind of right up to COVID, it certainly shocked the oil business. So that has dropped off dramatically. It has crept up some. I would say there have been some incremental pipelines expansions that have relieved the need for crude by rail. But the intention of this project is to relieve that need for crude by rail to really grow anymore. There might be a little bit of movement that is sort of structural that I don't think very much of it goes through Will County. This would definitely reduce the need for more. At times before COVID there was a lot about 50 thousand barrels could fit on a 100-car unit train. So that was (9) nine unit trains a day coming in the US. Of course, those trains have to go back to fill them back up. That is 18 trains most of the traffic is going through Illinois and portions going through Will County. That was a bad situation we are trying to avoid it with this project.
Sherry Newquist: Railroads runs through a section of my district and actually the UP the Union Pacific does too and I see a fair amount of tankers traffic on that line as well, kind of surprisingly. Thank you.
Julie Berkowicz: Thank you. I wanted to share with the committee that Destinee and I had a nice long chat and as I promised her I went and asked about this type of project. They did not have any concerns about having this type of a terminal in our county. They did also share with me that there hasn't been any issues as of this point and time. I have some feedback regarding their plan. That they would implement that I will share with staff and then they can share it with the whole County Board and with the Land Use Committee. Basically they have an emergency preparedness plan for many types of emergencies including something along this line. All the safeguards are in place if anyone does have concerns. We are in good hands, I felt that was something really important to know. Because I know there are some concerns that have been concerned about the what if's. This kind of shows us that there is sound planning and resources and procedures that is there were any type of issues. Which we don't anticipate but we have good people here who are always ready and on it at a moment’s notice. I was very satisfied with that response and I will share it with you Destinee.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Thank you. Any more questions from the committee? Destinee.
Destinee Ortiz: Going back to the first question about notifying the agencies. I like that you brought up that you spoke to Lockport yesterday and that he did have some questions although he does support it. I do believe that the Mayor of Romeoville, might have similar questions or questions of his own. I did reach out to him, I am hoping to heard back from him. I do believe that we should, this is directed towards staff, is there any way that we can change the process so that agencies are notified multiple times in multiple different modes of communication by any chance? Do we have to get a resolution for that to happen?
Brain Radner: There is a couple of different things. Illinois compiles statues requiring notification. Then the zoning ordinance requires notification. If there is something that the County Board desires to be different, we have to evaluate if the staff is allowed to do that, if the change is even legal under the complied statutes and then if it was then this committee could chose to deliberate a text amendment that would change the notification process.
Destinee Ortiz: I have questions about the public hearing because I read in the agenda packet that there were no objections during the public hearing. When was the public hearing for this?
Mr. Nelson: We have had a number of public hearings over the past, I am trying to think of al the public hearings we have had, not necessarily Will County but in the City of Lockport. (1) one of the notable ones that comes to memory was on game (7) seven of the Cubs World Series week in city hall. While the Cubs fortunately went into extra innings, so we finished up before the game was over. So, I am not sure I quite understand the public hearings, we certainly have had the public hearings in this immediate process for zoning. There has been a variety of public hearings and public comments at the Federal, State and Municipal level. People comment in hearing times over the past since the World Series, so it has been a few years.
Destinee Ortiz: Were there any public hearing held in Romeoville by any chance?
Mr. Nelson: No. They have been notified, I met with the mayor and mayor staff several times on this topic. Mayor has a concern that there was a pipeline operated by Enbridge that had a spill that was fortunately captured and cleaned up. It was what it was but that was difficult for the City of Romeoville. Some of the challenges because of that particular situation. I know that is the mayor’s big concern. Talked with the fire departments locally and I know some folks that work for me have talked to Romeoville. There is interest in locating the fire department boats at our docks. So that they have quicker easier access than the current access fire boats for any incidence along the canal. That was their concern they understand that we are not Enbridge and in fact I will tell you Enbridge does not want this to happen because it causes more competition in their business and lowers the cost of fuel. I met with the senior executive just in the last couple of weeks to just try to soften him up and I wasn't successful. I would suggest this is probably a good project for you to consider.
Destinee Ortiz: Thank you so much for adding that. I have a question for staff, it is kind of the same question that I had about notifying agencies. Is it the same process, the text amendment change so that we can kind of review how we notify neighbors in the areas close to these special use permit. Currently right now they only have to notify people within, I don't know how many feet, can we increase that boundary so that more people can be aware of changes to there communities.
David Dubois: First of all the County held public hearings on June 6, 2023. Will County Planning and Zoning Commission. That meeting did have a publication filed within the appropriate newspaper publication. As well as required abutting property notification. That is the radius of the location the municipalities. With required to the other public hearings just in general the county requires notification jurisdiction, municipal jurisdictions within a mile and a half. As the county requires
It is between the applicant and the municipalities as to whether or not they go through a process there. Same thing with the township. The county itself does not require public hearings with other agencies. We follow state law and state statute Will County's code. As far as the question with regard to a text amendment for changing procedural requirements again something you would have to consulted the State's Attorney's Office about and look at the state and combined statues and see if the county is authorized to do that. The county's code is
Destinee Ortiz: So right now, the county does not have a radius notification. David Dubois: No.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: County Board member Trainer.
County Board Member Trayner: Thank you Chair Pretzel. A question and a comment. For those of you not aware 40 thousand gallons of crude oil was involved in a freight train wreck in 2017 in Naperville. Stuff went all over the place. We were just fortunate that most of it was along the rail tracks. Apparently from what I am reading it never went into homeowners yards. I assume if there were wells in the area this company was probably required to do some well monitoring. I am all in favor of getting rid of as many trains as we can. Even though it is a very economical way to move product across the United States vs a tractor trailer truck. I hate trucks even worse than I hate trains. My question has to do with that pipeline tunnel. I have been reading recently about the new water pipeline that is going to be coming out this way to provide water to Joliet and the surrounding communities and I was told that it was going to be a hundred feet underground at least in the portion that goes through our forest preserve. That if I did not misunderstand them, when they drill through that bed rock or whatever is down there a hundred feet down which is probably bedrock. They will be sealing it and then putting the pipe through. Do you seal this at all do you know?
Mr. Nelson: That a little bit beyond, I will tell you what I know, and it is limited on this technology. You do the drill and do a burnishing of the walls to make sure it is smooth. Then you pull the pipe through with an extra thick coating to help it slide through the tunnel. That is what they do. They want to make sure that the rock, limestone in our case, is smooth. I am not aware that they do any sort of sealing of that tunnel itself. There is a coating on the pipe itself. You have the wall smooth; you have the coated pipe and that pipe from memory it is going to be at least a half inch steel thick.
County Board Member Trayner: How big?
Mr. Nelson: Thirty inch.
County Board Member Trayner: The one they are talking about for the water pipeline is (6) six feet. I have watched Netflix some of those documentaries where you can put (2) two lanes of traffic through the hole that they drilled. I know there are different sizes.
Mr. Nelson: This is going to be a big hole. I think it is a forty-two inch tunnel, I am not sure about the tunnel size.
County Board Member Trayner: Maybe on the portion coming down to the bedrock they would have like some sort of extra covering, but you wouldn't necessarily know that.
Mr. Nelson: In this area where that pipe is going to be is limestone bedrock is just a few feet underground. It is really limestone all the way.
County Board Member Trayner: Yeah, we learned that when we built the courthouse. It is very hard to have a basement in downtown Joliet. Definitely not an underground garage. Do you have any sort of equipment that goes through that pipelining as part of a testing. I seem to remember hearing about maybe it was the North American Pipeline that was coming from Canada sown to the states. That they talked about having these little robots they send through every so often that like check the integrity of the pipe.
Mr. Nelson: That is a standard requirement in the pipeline business now. Generally referred to as a smart pig. Years ago we would send pigs through the pipe line just to make sure it was cleared out everyone in a awhile. Now what we do is a whole sonar rig, the pig will drag sensors and you are checking any problem with the pipe. Essentially, internally or externally. All the way through the length of the pipe. So, you would have launchers and receivers at both ends of the pipe. Our pipe is approximately (2) two miles long and will have a launcher and every few years by statute we will run a pig through it, evaluate the data and say is there anything problems. I think I mentioned before, the most common reason for pipeline leaks are external hits from construction or something like that. Because it is such a short pipeline we will be monitoring this pipe every single day. It is right in our neighborhood and we will know if anybody is digging nearby we will know. That is the biggest single issue. That is what happened in the case of the Enbridge leak in Romeoville.
County Board Member Trayner: I was just going to say that is what happened in Romeoville.
Mr. Nelson: It was an external thing. That is most of these problems. There is a whole procedure. You can actually go in the department transportation look at all the pipes they have a lot of statistics they file in terms of how often they run this, how many problems they saw. If it is a little problem you are going to check it in this period of time. If it is a sever concern you have to address it right away. It is a pretty well-developed program.
County Board Member Trayner: How deep is your pipeline going to go?
Mr. Nelson: It depends on where it is, bit underneath the canal will be approximately 20- 25 feet below the bottom of the canal. Now this canal was built for ships, it doesn't hold ships today. It is actually extra deep. If we are 25 feet below the canal, I think it is 27 feet deep, above the edge of the wall there we are about 50 feet deep.
County Board Member Trayner: I don't see anybody digging in the canal.
Mr. Nelson: It is all rock, you would have to go through rock. So that part is really not worried about external hits.
County Board Member Trayner: That is what I was trying to get at. Ok thank you very much.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Back to member Ortiz.
Destinee Ortiz: Thank you. Mr. Nelson does your company have a history of accidents or any hazmat incidences and if so what is the largest (1) one?
Mr. Nelson: We do not have any.
Destinee Ortiz: That is good. There have been brought to the board’s attention (1) one of them is environmental impact study is essentially missing. Have you done the environmental impact study on this?
Mr. Nelson: Not the official environmental impact study due to the size and the scope. We have done a number of environmental studies. Nature species, I forget all the studies we have done. There is a hand full of endangered species in this area. So, we have had a number of different parties, in fact we hired some folks from the University of Illinois to come and check to see if there are any of the endangered turtles that could be in this area. So, they went and trapped turtles on this property and none of them were of the endangered species. That said we will still have a protective barrier to make sure none of the turtles get into the construction area or frankly onto the operating site during construction or operations. The thing that they did find existing on the site was somebody had dumped oil many years ago and so that was cleaned up because of the work that we had done that actually discovered it. Waste oil had been dumped on the site because it is a sort of dilapidated site that nobody looks at. We identified that and it has been cleaned up now. Already a plus it happened because we were prodding.
Destinee Ortiz: So, you said there was no requirement because of the size of your project was too big or too small.
Mr. Nelson: Too small. We are building a terminal. The impact and again it has been studied by multiple agencies, IDNR, Army Corp of Engineers, water and air division have evaluated and approved it. We have done the historical study done, the EcoCat multiple times. We have met all the basic requirements for what is a pretty small project.
Destinee Ortiz: It is just concerning because at the last board meeting a county board member had asked about that and I do believe your response was that you were building a facility that was designed to make sure there was no environmental impact. I have never seen a facility that had no environmental impact. You said that quote in the minutes, I took that from your comment.
Mr. Nelson: I am breathing air and I am impacting the environment every minute. That surprises me I am sorry to say. We are all impacting the environment every minute of every day.
Destinee Ortiz: This is directed towards staff, because I asked when I first became a board member about the environmental impact statements. And Brian told me that before you apply there is an environmental impact study done. So, is there any way we can require environmental impact statements for projects of this sort even though they are not large and who would be conducting that study if we did?
Mr. Nelson: I can offer a comment. So, when you have a project, you are always looking at who is the lead agency. Who is going to review what the necessary requirements are. We use the Army Corp of Engineers because of the nature of the project. The Army Corp of Engineers was and continues to be the lead agency during construction. Once we go into operation it will split who is doing it because we will have the Coast Guard because we are on the waterway, the Coast Guard will deal with it. There will be some EPA requirements that will be our lead agency then. We have been working with the Army Corp of Engineers on the permits and we met all the requirements going through what all their requirements were and they reached out to all the other agencies as the lead agency to make sure everyone was aware of the project and that we complied with and did all the studies that were necessary. There has been a lot of studies done. I am not an environmental engineer I do not believe that we did an environmental impact statement, I believe that is something bigger. We did do a number of studies to make sure it is properly met, and we did met all of those requirements to get a joint permit from the Army Corp of Engineers for the project.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Director did you want to address that.
David Dubois: EIS'S are Government documents that are mandated by federal office of projects. Our office relies upon other agencies. If they require a permit that requires the EIS we don't do that.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Thank you. Member Newquist.
Sherry Newquist: Just really quickly, I know you mentioned IDNR, I thought I had seen in some of the material that they were involved in this project? What role do they play? I am assuming they are in approval.
Mr. Nelson: IDNR had been involved multiple times. Pretty much every time they are involved, they have a couple thoughts. Brain mentioned they had some requirements here; those requirements were previously added to our joint permit. IDNR was (1) one of the agencies that the Army Corp of Engineers reached out to early on, so they have been involved. Then pretty much every other agency that we reach out to Will County being (1) one. They will comment again.
Sherry Newquist: So, what you are saying about the Army Corp of Engineers is it is really their responsibility to deal with IDNR and any other agencies at the federal or state level that would have to approve this process vs us is what Dave is saying.
Mr. Nelson: Yes, it is true, the Army Corp of Engineers, then they reach out to get the permits made requests and process each of those agencies has directly with us. We did have to fill things out for the IDNR to address questions. Each of them would have public, the question you had about public hearings, some of them would have public hearing or public comment process separately. It was not just the Army Corp of Engineers, no each of these agencies had their own public comment and involvement process.
Sherry Newquist: Ok I just wanted to make sure I understood that thanks.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Member Berkowicz.
Julie Berkowicz: Thank you Chair Pretzel. As far as the environmental studies and the due diligence in this particular case. In our files you can go to page 27 - 70 and you will see the reports from Soil and Water, EcoCat and IDNR so it is in our packet. We have gotten a response on this. Again, I just want to state this is the second time it is coming back to the board it came to the board back in 2015 or 2017. It was approved but the project was halted because the permitted he had not obtained the permitting from other entities. So now it is back here in the county. We have got plenty of documentation here. We also have those reports that are submitted from EcoCat, IDNR, and Soil and Water. So, I think that we should call the question if we could at this point.
Destinee Ortiz: I would just like to point out that we approved this in 2015 before any of the permits were approved.
Julie Berkowicz: Their permits are not applicable to the county. So those are permits from different government entities.
Destinee Ortiz: I understand that.
Julie Berkowicz: Everything in our packet here pertains to what we as a county are responsible for and comply with according to our statutes. So basically, we need to look at this information we have right here in front of us. And I found that those reports were very helpful in terms of environmental issues. I also spoke with Mr. Nelson right before the meeting and I think he is am awesome and amazing, U of I is an amazing advocate for our farms and our environment. I was very happy to hear that they had taken the initiative to work with them. So, like in scouting, sounds like you are leaving it better than you found it. Which is one of our mottos in scouting.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: I would like to say to I know this is a topic of high interest for a lot of people. We are not voting to approve a pipeline today. Right. We are voting on a map amendment (3) three special use permits. So, I too would like to vote on this, but Member Berkowiczs did comment, so you can't but Deane-Schlottman could.
Deane-Schlottman I will call question.
Sherry Newquist: I second.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Second from Newquist. Call Roll.
Dawn Tomczak: Map amendment from A-1 to I-1.
Roll call 4-1.
Destinee Ortiz: So, I have all these questions. I thought this would be the time to ask. Chair Frankie Pretzel: We have (3) three more things to vote on.
Destinee Ortiz: So, I don't get a chance to ask.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: We are going to vote on special use permits next. We have to vote on the zoning map amendment.
Dawn Tomczak: Correct.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: We have special use permit for manufacturing industrial services. May I have a motion and a second.
Sherry Newquist: Motion.
Julie Berkowicz: Second.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Motion Newquist second Berkowitz.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Now is your opportunity to ask a question.
Destinee Ortiz: So, do you have the compensatory litigations.
Mr. Nelson: For what?
Destinee Ortiz: For I guess any accidents that would happen. Do you have an insurance policy for this project?
Mr. Nelson: Yes we do.
Destinee Ortiz: What is it?
Mr. Nelson: Right now we have a construction policy in excess of one hundred million dollars. I can't tell you the exact number because I don't remember it. I know it is in excess of one hundred million.
Destinee Ortiz: I have a question I guess it is legal. Does anybody know if the county will be liable for any accidents that were to happen?
State's Attorney Scott Piles: I would have to have some context that is a very broad open ended question. What kind of accident are you talking about, are you talking about a spill, are you talking about some sort of an incident because we approved this project and there is a spill. Are you talking about is there an issue whether or not there was an error in some of the hearing process, specifically what kind of an accident are you talking about?
Destinee Ortiz: Let's start with the spill. Is the County liable for any costs. Since we approved the project.
State's Attorney Scott Piles: I would have to research it. I don't know under what scenario the county would be responsible unless there is a state statue requiring to contribute to some clean up, is there an ordinance relating to that. The county is not involved in the operation of this pipeline. The current issue is we are talking about a special use permit is that correct?
Chair Frankie Pretzel: That is correct.
State's Attorney: I don't know under what circumstance the county could. Obviously, I have not researched it. Matt has not researched it so I cannot give a definitive opinion as to whether or not the county would be liable for any costs in the event of a spill.
Destinee Ortiz: Ok. The next question is. Have there been any discussion into developing a Will County Community impact bond for this project?
Mr. Nelson: An impact bond? I am sorry.
Destinee Ortiz: Yes.
Mr. Nelson: I am sorry I don’t know what that is.
Destinee Ortiz: Sometimes communities set up these bonds when projects come before boards so that this bond can invest in processed that we use to finance projects within energy signature.
Mr. Nelson: I guess I can't say that it does that I am aware of. What we have done not for the county but for the City of Lockport. They intend to use some funds if we are hanging them for the right of way. They intended to use that for quiet zones on the (2) two railroads that run through. It is not impact on that we are just cutting the check. The intention is for the easement the pipe how they use those funds are their choices. At the night of the ballgame, they intended to use it for the noise. It has taken such a long time I think they have already done something to mitigate the noise. I am not sure they will use it for that purpose now. So, no there is nothing else. I will say the impact here is extremely low and we actually think we are reducing the impact. We might be reciprocated of such funds because of the lower impact that we are having.
Kaite Deane-Schlottman: I am going to call a question on this.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: We have a motion to call question, do I have a second? Julie Berkowicz: Second.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Second Berkowicz. Sorry Steve.
Steve Balich: I just wanted to let everybody know the county cannot be sued for anything like that, any code violations the county can't be sued for. The county is exempt because they have culpable liability. Remember back in 2019 we were doing building codes everyone kept saying we don't do it the county can be sued. No the county cannot be sued for anything. So just remember that when your talking about can we be sued. Anyone can sue for anything, but you won't win. The best example of culpable liability in Chicago all the back porches were collapsing and the people that had their porches inspected could not sue and the people didn't get them inspected couldn't sue either. So it applies to all governments.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Thank you Steve. Would you please call roll.
Dawn Tomczak: To call the question.
Roll Call vote was taken. 4-1. Passed.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Motion passes we are now going to vote on special use permit for manufacturing and industrial services.
Dawn Tomczak: With conditions applied.
Roll Call vote was taken. 4-1.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Ok next we have Special use permit for manufacturing and industrial services, different pin #. Can I get a motion and a second.
Katie Deane-Schlottman: Motion.
Julie Berkowitz: Second.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: I have a motion and a second, I will open this up for comments, questions member Otiz.
Destinee Ortiz: You mentioned that the City of Lockport is going to get cut a check for this project. Is Will County going to get the same?
Mr. Nelson: We are not getting any property from Will County. The reason the check was paid was for the easement for the pipe.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: For quiet zones.
Mr. Nelson: They were going to use it for quite zones that is not really my thing. I was just paying for the easement. Will County doesn't have any property here. The property everything that is being voted on today is owned by MWRD and the Metropolitan Water Reclamation of Greater Chicago. We will be paying money to them for leasing the property and for the easement.
Destinee Ortiz: How much tax money is the county going to be benefiting from this project, do you know.
Mr. Nelson: I do not have it off the top of my tongue but it will increase the base tax now. The primary thing that is accessed on this type of facility is the storage tanks. There is a used storage tank number and a new storage tank number. Ours are fairly new so we will be paying new storage tanks number. A couple hundred thousand dollars a year I will say.
Destinee Ortiz: If there were a leak, worse case scenario. One hundred and fifty barrels into the canal, do you believe rate payers and tax payers would suffer the clean-up cost burden?
Mr. Nelson: No. First of all we will have insurance to cover it. If the tanker men caused it they have insurance to cover that. If all those things fail in terms of their insurance, because of some big number the insurance company can't handle. There is an insurance we pay into as we move oil we pay into a government insurance fund that then would be the party to suffer the high end of that. It is covered. Frankly because of that there are a number of emergency response companies that are set up to come in very quickly. Like happened in the Enridge case. Because the longer you let it wait the worse it gets. They have lots of vacuum trucks. The advantage is we are on a canal, that is a huge advantage. You can boom that thing very easily and capture the oil and suck it out of there. Verses an open body of water or a free flowing body of water. That is a huge advantage in this case. It is (1) one of the reasons it is a great location.
Katie Deane-Schlottman: I want to make motion to hold questions.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: I have a motion.
Julie Berkowitcz: Second.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: I have a motion and a second Dawn please call roll. Dawn Tomczak: Call question.
Roll Call was taken. 4-1. Passed.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Now we are going to vote on special use permit for manufacturing and industrial services. General for pin# 11-04-22-400-001-0000.
Dawn Tomczak: With conditions.
Roll call. 4-1.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Motion passes. Next, we have special use permit for manufacturing and industrial services, pin # 11-04-22-200-006-0000.
Katie Deane-Schlottman: Motion.
Julie Berkowitz: Second.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Motion and a second I open it up for comments. We will start with member Ortiz.
Destinee Ortiz: These questions are about train traffic. Will Ducere stop all the railcar transport once the terminal is completed?
Mr. Nelson: I think I mentioned before Ducere is a small company. We are going to do our part in business. We do not control the entire oil industry in North America. Nobody really does. The purpose of our project is to take barrels off rails. We hope to be very successful in that. It is a competitive business. It costs about twice as much to haul by rail as it does by barge. We think we will be successful. I can't control what other companies do.
Destinee Ortiz: Right so hypothetically you can take your oil off of the rail and another company can go and put their oil on the rail to say hey we need to transport it this way because we don't have any other way.
Mr. Nelson: If they just want to spend more money they could. It tends to not happen because everybody is economically motivated. They tend to only go by rail if they have to. You are right it is a free country. If you want to spend a lot more money doing it anyway you can. It just doesn't happen very much in our business.
Destinee Ortiz: How much crude oil do you currently transport via rail per day.
Mr. Nelson: We do not transport any by rail. Today the US is importing about a hundred thousand barrels a day by rail from Canada. That is as an industry, I looked up the states yesterday. That is kind of what it is right now. That is about (2) two trains a day. I didn't look at where they were going. I am not sure they are going through Will County. Oil is worth more on the west coast frankly. IN the future there is a pipeline that is going to the west coast and that is going to supply the west coast. That is another reason that is going to send those railcar's this way.
Destinee Otiz: So do you have an idea of how much of this oil is actually staying ion Will County refineries and how much is going to the gulf. Is most of it going to the gulf or is most of it staying here. Is all of it going to the gulf?
Mr. Nelson: There are (2) two refineries in Will County. (1) runs about two hundred and seventy-five thousand barrels a day, the other (1) one about one hundred seventy-five thousand barrels a day. Those refineries get all of their oil basically off the Enridge pipeline directly. They might take a little bit of the barge oil just for funny events, there are always strange things that happen in our business. We will largely be taking the oil that is excess of that. Either due to their operational challenges they have trouble running the refinery that day so we will load those extra barrels that aren't in the pipe. On the average system coming to Chicago there is about (2) two million barrels a day total. Coming to this area on the Enridge system. We can take up to four hundred and fifty thousand of that if we need to unload that system. And keep it from loading rail up in Canada and shipping it down.
Katie Deane-Schlottman: Motion to call question.
Julie Berkowitz: Second.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Motion Deane-Schlottman, second Berkowitz. Roll on calling the questions.
Dawn Tomczak: Calling the question.
Roll call vote was taken. 4-1.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Motion carries. We are now going to vote on special use permit for manufacturing and industrial services for pin# 11-04-22-200-006-0000 w/ conditions.
Dawn Tomczak: We are voting on the special use permit.
Roll Call Vote. 4-1.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Thank you for your time.
Motion to Stop Questions
Will County Land Use Development Committee approved by roll call vote, 4-0.
| RESULT: APPROVED [4 TO 1]
MOVER: Katie Deane-Schlottman, Member SECONDER: Julie Berkowicz, District 10 (R - Naperville) AYES: Pretzel, Deane-Schlottman, Newquist, Berkowicz NAYS: Ortiz ABSENT: Coleman, Mitchell |
Motion to Approve Zoning Map Amendment A-1 to I-1
| RESULT: APPROVED [4 TO 1]
MOVER: Sherry Newquist, Member SECONDER: Julie Berkowicz, District 10 (R - Naperville) AYES: Pretzel, Deane-Schlottman, Newquist, Berkowicz NAYS: Ortiz ABSENT: Coleman, Mitchell |
Motion to Stop Questions
Will County Land Use Development Committee approved by roll call vote, 4-0.
| RESULT: APPROVED [4 TO 1]
MOVER: Katie Deane-Schlottman, Member SECONDER: Julie Berkowicz, District 10 (R - Naperville) AYES: Pretzel, Deane-Schlottman, Newquist, Berkowicz NAYS: Ortiz ABSENT: Coleman, Mitchell |
Motion to Approve Special Use Permit for Manufacturing and Industrial Services W/5 conditions
| RESULT: APPROVED [4 TO 1]
MOVER: Sherry Newquist, Member SECONDER: Julie Berkowicz, District 10 (R - Naperville) AYES: Pretzel, Deane-Schlottman, Newquist, Berkowicz NAYS: Ortiz ABSENT: Coleman, Mitchell |
Motion to Stop Question
Will County Land Use Development Committee approved by roll call vote, 4-0.
| RESULT: APPROVED [4 TO 1]
MOVER: Katie Deane-Schlottman, Member SECONDER: Julie Berkowicz, District 10 (R - Naperville) AYES: Pretzel, Deane-Schlottman, Newquist, Berkowicz NAYS: Ortiz ABSENT: Coleman, Mitchell |
Motion to Approve Special Use Permit Manufacturing and Industrial Services 4-1
| RESULT: APPROVED [4 TO 1]
MOVER: Katie Deane-Schlottman, Member SECONDER: Julie Berkowicz, District 10 (R - Naperville) AYES: Pretzel, Deane-Schlottman, Newquist, Berkowicz NAYS: Ortiz ABSENT: Coleman, Mitchell |
Motion to Stop Questions
Will County Land Use Development Committee approved by roll call vote, 4-0.
| RESULT: APPROVED [4 TO 1]
MOVER: Katie Deane-Schlottman, Member SECONDER: Julie Berkowicz, District 10 (R - Naperville) AYES: Pretzel, Deane-Schlottman, Newquist, Berkowicz NAYS: Ortiz ABSENT: Coleman, Mitchell |
Motion to Approve Special Use Permit for Manufacturing and Industrial Services w/5 conditions
| RESULT: APPROVED [UNANIMOUS]
MOVER: Julie Berkowicz, District 10 (R - Naperville) SECONDER: Katie Deane-Schlottman, Member AYES: Pretzel, Deane-Schlottman, Newquist, Ortiz, Berkowicz ABSENT: Coleman, Mitchell |
V. OTHER BUSINESS
1. Text Amendments to the Will County Contractors Registration Bonding and Insurance Ordinance ;Self Retention Insurance for Liability Insurance Chapter 117.06 (Brian Radner)
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Brian, would you shed a little light on this.
Brain Radner: The self-insured retention issue pertains to the contractor’s registration bonding ordinance requiring liability insurance is required. We started to see this year a couple of larger corporations used the self-insured retention policies to fill that requirement. We consulted with the State's Attorney Office, and they advised us that we cannot accept self-retention liability policies. Generally speaking, the first one hundred thousand dollars that was the self-insured portion and that would mean that, that policy one million would not be paid out until the company paid the first one hundred thousand. So, their view was that because of that, that is not liability insurance in the sense that other contractor submits one hundred percent liability insurance policies. If there was an incident on the property, the policy would pay from the get-go. So, the self-retention policy is a little different. It is saying that the person that submitted that policy has the funds on hand to cover expenses like that. With the guides of the State's Attorney’s Office, we prepared a text amendment that will make it clear that the county does not accept self-insured retention policies for liability insurance. That is it in a nutshell.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Us passing this pretty much just brings it to a level playing field for the county. If we decided not to then we would have to putting a lot of burden on our staff. Any questions or comments. Any comments from County Board members?
Julie Berkowicz: So, make a motion to accept the recommendation by staff. Katie Deane-Schlottman: Second.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: I have a motion and a second. Roll call vote.
Motion to Approve Text Amendments to the Will County Contractors Registration Bonding and Insurance
Will County Land Use Development Committee approved by roll call vote, unanimously, 5-0.
| RESULT: APPROVED [UNANIMOUS]
MOVER: Julie Berkowicz, District 10 (R - Naperville) SECONDER: Katie Deane-Schlottman, Member AYES: Pretzel, Deane-Schlottman, Newquist, Ortiz, Berkowicz ABSENT: Coleman, Mitchell |
2. Building Ordinance requirements for pre-manufactured accessory storage space (Brian Radner)
Brian Radner: Our Chief Building official is asking for additional time to complete information. So, recommendation would be to continue to the August meeting.
Motion to Postpone to August
Will County Land Use Development Committee approved to Postpone by roll call vote, unanimously, 5-0.
| RESULT: MOVED FORWARD [UNANIMOUS]
MOVER: Sherry Newquist, Member SECONDER: Julie Berkowicz, District 10 (R - Naperville) AYES: Pretzel, Deane-Schlottman, Newquist, Ortiz, Berkowicz ABSENT: Coleman, Mitchell |
3. Discussion: WC Zoning Ordinance - Industrial & Commercial Uses Including Associated Text Amendments (Land Use Department)
Postpone to August 8, 2023. Special meeting
4. Updates of the Land Resource Management Plan (LRMP) (Colin Duesing)
Colin Duesing: Based on the discussion last month we are looking at possible setting up a special meeting to dedicate better time to just this.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Can we give that to him right now. He has just a couple options dates for us. I think it is better on a day we are all here. Do you want to make it after the next meeting. August.
Chair Ogala: I would just like to suggest, that would make your day very long. Rather than that do a first Thursday of the month after Forest preserve and do it exactly after that. Think about it whatever you guys would like. I offer that as a suggestion or if you want to do it after Land Use.
Commission discusses when to have meeting.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Once you have that information and say miraculously we all agree. Then what would be the next steps?
Colin Duesing: With that I would come up with a draft ordinance highlighting what the changes will be obviously. But also putting in a little side note as to what the committee had said based on that survey. To make sure that what you are saying to me with that survey is what is being reflected in the text amendment.
Commission continues to discusses when to have meeting.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Hold on let's reel it back in. We need to get a date. Colin can you please look at August 8, 2023 right now.
Colin Duesing: I am pretty sure we can do August 8, 2023. It will be August 8, 2023 either here or in the committee room.
VI. REPORTS, COMMUNICATIONS, CORRESPONDENCE
1. Chair, Will County Land Use and Development Committee
2. Committee Members, Will County Land Use and Development Committee
3. Director, Will County Land Use Department
4. Other
5. Public Comment
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Anyone from the public here to comment today? We do have some, ok. Would you like to step down to the microphone.
Randy Juras: I am from Lockport and this reminds me of the ICC. Illinois commerce commission this body is put in place to make sure that ____depo is put in place. I can truly say most of the people in our area have no idea this is happening. About a decade ago we fought it then and we are losing now. It is unbelievable that you people can't remember July 2010 that Enbridge line polluted the Kalamazoo River like you couldn't believe. You think it can't happen again. Just look at your own history. That guy can tell you anything he wants. But you are in jeopardy you are putting everybody in jeopardy. It is unbelievable that this has gotten this far.
Sandy Burcenski: My name is Sandy. I have been sitting at this meeting and I sat at the meeting (2) two weeks ago. The way I feel right now is so furious I don't even know where to begin, considering that none of you really care about hearing what I have to say. You already voted you allowed a man to come up her and talk and question and give all his. Do you know what is going through those lines, do you even know what is going through those pipelines. Do you know what is going to be in storage tanks. I sit back there, and I feel like a second-class citizen. The biggest thing I wanted to ask all of you is who pays your salary. Does Ducere pay your salary or do the citizens of Will County pay your salary because as far as I am concerned right now, I feel like there is taxation without representation. I don’t know who is representing us right now. You have a couple of the Will County Board members that go all out and try to do what is right. But everything comes back to money. So, what is going to happen when something does happen to that pipeline. Whether it is underground, if it leaks underground now ok it is bedrock. Well guess what it is fractured bedrock so guess where it is going to go to the aquafer and guess what is going to happen then it is going to affect your water. The groundwater. Depending on what is coming through the pipes and in all likely hood it is tar sand. It is bitumen, it is some of the most toxic mixture coming through there. What is going to be in the storage tanks? And then you talk about liability. What is going to happen when worst case scenario something leaks like Kalamazoo which they are still clearing up over ten years later at a cost of over a billion dollars. Who is going to pay for this? You say there is no liability nobody can sue, oh my gosh, nobody can come after Will County and sue us. Who is going to be responsible if they can't. Who is going to clean this up. It is going to come back to the taxpayers of Will County. What are you actually getting out of this. I don’t hear anything. What is this bringing to Will County to make Will County a better place. I am just so livid. I thank you for allowing me to vent, but I want you people to realize what is going on. Before you make these decisions, if you want to do your due diligence and go and investigate railcars. He puts the spotlight on this so you are not looking at this. It is a tactic with these corporations. I would ask you to seriously, does this go before the Will County Board next week? I would ask any of you board members here to seriously consider this. Think about who you represent. Here is the thing you don't represent Duasasf you represent the people of Will County, thank you.
Chair Frankie Pretzel: Do we have any other comments from the public? Any other comments from the public.
No response.
VII. EXECUTIVE SESSION
VIII. ADJOURNMENT
Motion to Adjourn
Will County Land Use Development Committee approved by voice vote, unanimously, 5-0.
| RESULT: APPROVED [UNANIMOUS]
MOVER: Sherry Newquist, Member SECONDER: Julie Berkowicz, District 10 (R - Naperville) AYES: Pretzel, Deane-Schlottman, Newquist, Ortiz, Berkowicz ABSENT: Coleman, Mitchell |
IX. NEXT MEETING IS SCHEDULED FOR AUGUST 8, 2023
https://willcountyil.iqm2.com/Citizens/FileOpen.aspx?Type=12&ID=4571&Inline=True
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