Will County Judicial Committee met April 2.
Here is the minutes provided by the committee:
I. CALL TO ORDER / ROLL CALL
Chair Tyler Marcum called the meeting to order at 9:00 AM
| Attendee Name | Title | Status |
| Tyler Marcum | Chair | Present |
| Herbert Brooks Jr. | Vice Chair | Present |
| Mimi Cowan | Member | Present |
| Gloria Dollinger | Member | Present |
| Tim Kraulidis | Member | Absent |
| Rachel Ventura | Member | Present |
| Tom Weigel | Member | Present |
Present from State's Attorney's Office: M. Tatroe and K. Grey.
II. PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG
Mr. Brooks led the Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.
III. APPROVAL OF MINUTES
1. WC Judicial Committee - Regular Meeting - Mar 5, 2019 9:00 AM
RESULT: APPROVED [UNANIMOUS]
MOVER: Rachel Ventura, Member
SECONDER: Mimi Cowan, Member
AYES: Marcum, Brooks Jr., Cowan, Dollinger, Ventura, Weigel
ABSENT: Kraulidis
IV. OLD BUSINESS
1. Request for Various Ordinance Amendments
(Undersheriff Conser)
This item was discussed after New Business.
Mr. Marcum indicated the State's Attorney and Sheriff are working on the language and will bring something back next month.
Ms. Ventura asked Ms. Dunn to provide the language in the statutes.
RESULT: TABLED [UNANIMOUS]
TO: Will County Board
MOVER: Rachel Ventura, Member
SECONDER: Mimi Cowan, Member
AYES: Marcum, Brooks Jr., Cowan, Dollinger, Ventura, Weigel
ABSENT: Kraulidis
Motion to Remove from Table
RESULT: APPROVED [UNANIMOUS]
MOVER: Rachel Ventura, Member
SECONDER: Tom Weigel, Member
AYES: Marcum, Brooks Jr., Cowan, Dollinger, Ventura, Weigel
ABSENT: Kraulidis
2. Resolution Supporting the Second Amendment and Opposing Illinois General Assembly and or any Local Governments Attempts to Restrict the Individual Right of U.S. Citizens as Protected by the Second Amendment of the U.S. Constitution - Attachment Added
(Steve Balich)
Mr. Marcum reviewed the County Board rules allowing three minutes for public comments.
Mr. Balich read the Resolution in the packet.
Mr. Jim Lynch spoke in favor of the Resolution.
Mr. Chet Toczek spoke in favor of the Resolution.
Mr. Edward Ronkowski spoke in favor of the Resolution.
Mr. Scott Lucas spoke in favor of the Resolution.
Mr. Brian Morgan spoked in favor of the Resolution.
Ms. Sharon Seliga spoke in opposition of the Resolution.
Ms. Janis Curtin spoke in opposition of the Resolution.
Ms. Nicole Sanders spoke in favor of the Resolution.
Mr. Doug Mayhall spoke in favor of the Resolution.
Mr. Mike Gorski spoke in favor of the Resolution.
Mr. Larry Kaitschuck spoke in favor of the Resolution and reviewed the attached map.
Mr. Fricilone, Mr. Brooks and Mr. Moustis left at this juncture.
Ms. Holly Fingere spoke in opposition of the Resolution.
Mrs. Dollinger left at this juncture.
Mr. Marcum reminded everyone to respect the opinions of everyone.
Ms. Laura Welch spoke in opposition of the Resolution.
Ms. Michelle Stiff spoke in opposition of the Resolution.
Ms. Erin Moncek spoke in opposition of the Resolution.
Mr. Gary Lind spoke in favor of the Resolution.
Mr. Tony Zurek spoke in favor of the Resolution.
Mr. Tom McCullagh spoke in favor of the Resolution.
Mr. Matt Quigley spoke in favor of the Resolution.
Mr. Marcum stated when state legislators or the federal government oversteps their bounds with the Second Amendment, the Courts put them in their place and restore everyone’s right to own a gun. I have faith in our judicial system and in our political system. This would be a symbolic measure as we do not have the statutory ability to tell the Sheriff’s or the State’s Attorney’s what laws to enforce and prosecute.
Ms. Ventura thanked everyone for their thoughtful comments, I appreciate you coming today. I am a FOID card carrier and enjoy shooting rifles. My concern is the title saying we are opposing the General Assembly. Then it goes on to say I have a constitutional right to uphold the law. The constitution gives us state law and we have to uphold the state laws. I feel the Resolution is not worded well, because it is asking me to choose between my County and my State. That is not fair. I think a majority of Americans want to have a respectful conversation about gun laws, compromise and needs. I recognize there is a need for those who enjoy shooting guns. We don’t want to take guns away. No one here is saying take the guns away from law abiding citizens or those who have the right; none of that is happening. I understand a woman has the right to safety. I left a very difficult marriage and I am lucky my girls and I are here today. There is a need for safety, a need for protection of our lives and a need on the flip side to protect that life. We need to have conversation, we need to compromise and come together. Passing this Resolution shuts down all conversations and that cannot happen. I will be voting no on this Resolution.
Ms. Cowan asked Mr. Grey does the current law allow you to defend yourself if someone is breaking into your home?
Mr. Grey replied absolutely.
Ms. Cowan continued if we don’t pass this Resolution, are the current laws in the State of Illinois still in effect?
Mr. Grey answered yes.
Ms. Cowan stated someone mentioned Marbury versus Madison; that says the Courts have the authority to determine what is unconstitutional.
Mr. Weigel stated it was mentioned by a couple of people we should be a sanctuary county. It is not mentioned in this Resolution. Can someone define what a sanctuary county is?
Mr. Balich replied this Resolution does not mention sanctuary. This is not a sanctuary bill. It says we, in Will County, recognize the Second Amendment as an important part of the U.S. Constitution. This says we support the U.S. Constitution, which is supposed to be above the Illinois Constitution. Anything in the Illinois Constitution contrary to the U.S. Constitution, would be unconstitutional, federal law supersedes state law. This Resolution says we believe, as a County, it is important to support the Second Amendment, as written in the U.S. Constitution. As it is written, if we vote no to this Resolution, we are voting no to the U.S. Constitution.
Mr. Weigel stated I would like to amend it to say Resolution in Support of the Second Amendment.
Ms. Cowan stated in the Legislative Committee we have agendas showing what we support and oppose at the federal level and state level. It seems you want us to say we oppose or support specific legislation. It seems to me this would be more appropriate at the Legislative Committee for consideration and to acknowledgement certain state laws we support of oppose as a County Board.
Mr. Balich stated originally I asked Ms. Winfrey to assign this to the Legislative Committee and she indicated it belongs at Judicial and that is why it is here. This does not talk about any of the laws. This says we support the U.S. Constitution as it was written. I agree with Mr. Weigel and perhaps we amend the title, but we are in support of the Second Amendment of the U.S. Constitution as it was written and it is the Supreme law of the United States of America. As far as I know, Illinois is still part of the United States of America.
Mrs. Summers thanked everyone for coming today and speaking. I have lived my whole life in a rural area. My dad was a hunter, my husband and son both hunt. My son-in-law and daughter are avid shooters. One of my best friends hold conceal carry classes at her home. I am not talking about taking away your gun rights. My issues come in and something that did not resonate with me; I had a fellow nurse come up here and speak. The verbiage and words used regarding who guns should be taken away from offended me very much. Mental health is a health issue and that is where we should be looking. Nothing in this Resolution supports getting mental health background checks.
Mr. Balich stated there is a good reason for that.
Mrs. Summers continued everyone has a right to speak here regardless of their opinion, but we have to do mental health background checks, we need to start pushing for it. I agree there is a health issue going on. I would appreciate it if people did not use the term “looney” that bothers me. It bothers me when people are up here talking about not making this a political issue, I heard it repeatedly. We need to make common sense laws to protect people. The timing on this was horrible. There was a shooting in Aurora. We have members on this Board living in that community. A County Board member lost a granddaughter, a great granddaughter and great grandson and I watched him do everything in his power last month to get through the meeting to thank people for all the support. That is domestic violence and that is what we are talking about. I don’t want to take your guns away; but we have to have common sense laws that protect Mr. Brooks’ granddaughter, one year old great grandson and a six year old great granddaughter. Try to get the verbiage for background checks in the Resolution.
Mr. Balich stated I brought this up in January. Bad people, criminals, gang bangers, do you think they care whether there is a law? The answer is no, they don’t. The Resolution is saying to the State, please do not create any more laws that infringe upon our rights, like stamp the shells so they cost more money or put a huge tax on purchases, tax dealers, to eliminate dealers. They want the entire state to have the same stupid laws as Chicago, a city with the most crime in the entire United States. I am not asking for a discussion on background checks or mental health or any of that in this Resolution.
Ms. Ventura stated that is the problem.
Mr. Balich continued that is not the problem. This Resolution is saying we 100% support the U.S. Constitution, which includes the Second Amendment. That is all it says. People are bringing up a lot of ancillary things; guess what if we are going to start talking about mental health, we can do nothing about it. We talk about a lot of things at this Board we have no power over. I am saying let’s support the Second Amendment as it is written in the U.S. Constitution and that is it. If people want to bring in the rest of it, then you are talking political. It is your opinion. Do you know how many democrats live in my district support me? There are countless ones. Do you know how many independents and libertarians live by me and want guns? Lots of them. Do you know how many women? Find out how many women got concealed carry licenses in Homer Glen. Because we hold classes and teach people, we have the most per capita concealed licenses in the State of Illinois. I am asking for your support of the U.S. Constitution, that is it. A no vote to this Resolution is a no vote to the U.S. Constitution.
Mr. Moran stated I don’t sit on this Committee and was not planning to speak today. Mr. Balich’s Resolution is not a sanctuary Resolution. It does not ask the State’s Attorney or the Sheriff not to enforce existing laws. Mental health background checks already exist for Illinois residents. Backgrounds checks are required for every firearm sale in Illinois, whether the sale is between private individuals or a gun dealer. People with FOID cards are background checked every day and every night. People with concealed carry permits are background checked every day and every night. In Aurora a person got a firearm that should not have been approved for a FOID card by the State Police. The problem is with the State of Mississippi who did not put the records online, it is not a problem with the State of Illinois; the State of Mississippi failed to do its job. I asked our local representatives to look into a law to require states, if they don’t do it be held liable by the federal government. There was a shooting at a church in Texas, by someone with a bad conduct discharge from the Air Force and the records were never forwarded to the system. The person responsible should be the person prosecuted. In the State of Mississippi, the person responsible for uploading this man’s record should be the person held accountable. What we are talking about is passing more laws to restrict responsible, legal firearm owners in the State of Illinois. In the 1980’s the City of Morton Grove and the City of Chicago passed a symbolic law restricting handgun ownership. The City of Chicago enforced it, Morton Grove did not. What they found almost immediately was the law had absolutely no effect on crime in the City of Chicago. It was a great distraction for politicians to use to distract people from the real problems in their society that would take more than one political term to fix. It would take forever to fix the terrible dropout rate in Chicago schools, the running away of businesses from the City of Chicago and the hopelessness in the communities. That stuff is hard to fix. It is easy to say it is the gun, it’s the gun dealer or the gun lobby. It is not the gun, it is the people. If we were serious about doing something about the gun problem in the U.S. we would look at mental health. Two-thirds of all firearm deaths in the United States are by suicide. About three-quarters of the rest are between gang bangers and the criminal element. Of the people who are murdered in Chicago, over 90% of them are convicted felons. Over 85% who people cleared of murders, which is dismal rate in the City of Chicago, are also convicted felons. We had paralegals do research in the City of Chicago last year and determined time after time after time, convicted felons in the City of Chicago, pinched with a firearm on the street, which is a five year mandatory federal sentence if arrested and convicted, are released on an I-Bond to go back on the street and perpetrate another violent crime. The revolving door of justice in Cook County and Chicago is its own problem and it does not need to extend to the rest of the state.
Ms. Cowan asked who was the “we” asking a paralegal to do research?
Mr. Moran replied ISRA; Illinois State Rifle Association. I am no longer the President of ISRA, but Mr. Doug Mayhall is here to represent their interest. I am speaking on behalf of myself. I have seen the data, the facts and the research done. The problem is they keep letting the same violent criminals out on the street to perpetrate the same crimes, nothing changes. Yet, tell people they cannot have a firearm. Put the violent criminal offenders away in prison where they belong. The reason prisons exist is to protect society from people who are a danger, but they don’t use it in Chicago, instead they blame the gun owner, the gun or the gun lobby.
Mrs. Ogalla stated I am happy Mr. Moran spoke since he has been the President of ISRA for years. Everything Mr. Moran said is the truth. I grew up in the City of Chicago and my parents had guns. I have lived in Will County for the past 38 years. We cannot just look at this as something that is wrong. It is right to support the U.S. Constitution. The problem is mental health. We have to deal with it. As Mr. Moran said, if you have a FOID card you are checked nightly to ensure you are not on record somewhere. What is happening is there are slips in the system which allow someone to get a gun. I don’t know how anyone in this room, on this Committee or on County Board can honestly say a gun is the problem. If a person has a mental health issue and their decision is to commit a crime, to kill someone or get back at someone, they will do it. They will shoot them, burn them, strangle them or whatever they decide. That is their mental state, it is not because they have a gun. I have guns in my house, I had guns when I lived in the City of Chicago and all of us kids knew where they were. We were taught to respect them and I did respect them, we never played with them. The problem is there are certain citizens within society that will commit a crime and unfortunately, it is horrific when they use certain measures. They can use a gun, but they can also take a car and drive into a crowd of people, they have blown up places. These things exist. The problem is we have this consistent fight and political issue. There is a certain group of people who think we should not have guns or if we make a stricter gun laws it will fix the problem. The City of Chicago has one of the strictest gun law in the United States, yet we have shooting every day. There are shootings every day because of the number of gangs in the City of Chicago is horrific. When I lived in Chicago we had the Gaylords versus the Latin Kings who fought in our school yard. When we went to school the next day there would be blood and teeth all over the playground. They didn’t use guns, they used pipes and bats to beat people up. They have gone from pipes and bats to guns. The problem is we need to support the Constitution of the United States and we need to stop passing more gun laws that restrict law abiding citizens. Law abiding citizens are not the problem. The problem is the person with a mental health issue or choses to be a member of a gang and commit crimes.
Ms. Koch stated this conversation is about specific legislation, things we want to do. This would be a more appropriate discussion for our Legislative Committee. We should look at the specific measures to push at the State and Federal level, working through the Legislative Committee. I feel saying we are going to support the Constitution is redundant and unnecessary. When I look at the map handed out earlier this smacks of a political maneuver to flex some muscle by the Counties on our State legislature. I appreciate this was requested to be brought to the Judicial Committee. I think this specific Resolution, because it is so redundant, needs to be broken down as we have talked about so many issues and many of you have weighed in on so many important things, we need to look at the issues individually. I hope I don’t have to vote on something redundant and unnecessary.
Ms. Koch left at this juncture.
Mr. Balich stated when I was elected, I brought a Resolution to make us the second county in Illinois to have concealed and open carry. Mr. Moran took it to his lawyers to be rewritten. That bill passed, it took a while and we become the third county to adopt it. It was advisory. We had no control, but we were telling the State what wanted. This is the same, we are saying we want the State to adhere to the U.S. Constitution. There is nothing illegal in there. The basic premise of this Resolution is telling the State of Illinois to respect the U.S. Constitution. We did this five years ago we passed conceal and open carry before the state passed conceal carry. I added open carry and it passed with a split Board. It was not a political thing, it was a 13-13 vote with Mr. Walsh breaking the tie to pass it. If Mr. Weigel would like to amend the title, fine as long as we are saying in Will County want the State to obey the Constitution as it was written. That is not too much to ask of Board Members who took an oath to the U.S. Constitution. This is something everyone should agree on. I thought it would be easier because we are talking about the U.S. Constitution. We are not talking about mental health and background checks, because we have laws on the books. I am not saying get rid of the laws on the books. I am saying respect the U.S. Constitution and adhere to it. We allow sanctuary cities, marijuana and we may or may not have sanctuary stuff in our County. Let’s be realistic. The U.S. Constitution is not being obeyed by the State and we are asking them it. This should go to the full County Board for a vote. Everyone should be on the record saying whether or not they support the U.S. Constitution. If this is not taken up by the full Board, I will stand up at every single meeting and ask why. It is important for the full Board to vote on this. There are people on both sides of the aisle with opinions. Everyone should support the Second Amendment as written and the U.S. Constitution.
Mrs. Ogalla stated there are members of this Committee who continue to say this should have gone to the Legislative Committee, our Speaker has been a Board Member for a very long time, knows the rules and she decided it should be heard at this Committee. For other members who are suggesting this go to another Committee, please remember our Speaker made the decision. That is why it is here. You need to respect our Speaker as well.
Motion to Remove from the Table
RESULT: APPROVED [UNANIMOUS]
MOVER: Herbert Brooks Jr., Vice Chair
SECONDER: Rachel Ventura, Member
AYES: Marcum, Brooks Jr., Cowan, Dollinger, Ventura, Weigel
ABSENT: Kraulidis
Motion to Move Resolution to the Full Board
RESULT: DEFEATED [0 TO 4]
MOVER: Tom Weigel, Member
SECONDER: Rachel Ventura, Member
NAYS: Marcum, Cowan, Ventura, Weigel
ABSENT: Kraulidis
LEFT MEETING: Brooks Jr., Dollinger
Motion to Amend the Title of the Resolution to Read Resolution Supporting the Second Amendment of the U.S. Constitution
Mr. Weigel made a motion to Amend the Title of the Resolution, which failed due to a lack of a second.
E-Mail from John Sheridan
(Handout)
E-Mail from Eric Moncek
(Handout)
V. OTHER OLD BUSINESS
VI. NEW BUSINESS
1. Discussion Re: Impact of Legislation Increasing Fines/Fees in Circuit Clerk's Office
(Andrea Chasteen)
This item was discussed before Old Business.
Mr. Squires gave an overview of the new legislation taking effect on July 1, 2019 and its impact to fines and fees in the Circuit Clerk’s Office. There is pending legislation which may change things. Our problem is programming everything and be ready for this on July 1st. We will be speaking at the Finance Committee next month to give them an estimate of the financial impact this will have on the County, which may be fairly significant. The goal of the legislation was to have more uniformity throughout the state.
Mr. Sepulveda stated the biggest change is the schedules for civil, criminal and quasi criminal. There are 14 schedules for criminal and quasi criminal, broken down into categories. The court will have some discretion on added fines. The biggest unknown is the fee waivers which can now be applied to criminal assessments. They have rewritten the Clerk’s Act which listed all the fees and now put them under the three schedules. The fee waivers open the door for a waiver of between 25% and 100% depending on income levels. This will be a major change. With the new legislation some fees were repealed, examples were given. Some of the assessments are very general going to the county general fund but with language they are to be spent directly toward the courts.
Mr. Gale stated before this goes into effect on July 1st we will need a comprehensive Ordinance. The easiest way would be to repeal the current Ordinances listing court fees and do one comprehensive Ordinance to cover all of it. The money may or may not go down. There have been several accounts repealed. It is up to the County Board to determine to what extent those items get funded in the future. The State’s Attorney will draft the Ordinance and bring it in May to be voted upon in June. You will have to determine where the money is going, how you want to fund the court system and to what extent.
Ms. Ventura asked is the waiver income based or are there qualifications?
Mr. Sepulveda answered it is income based; based on the federal poverty guidelines and other income guidelines.
Mr. Squires stated the waivers for each case could be different making it hard to determine the impact.
Mr. Sepulveda added when someone receives a partial waiver it is applied evenly to the entire assessment.
Mr. Squires stated next month we will come back with some better projections. Everything will be an estimate. There will be more revenues going to the municipalities for traffic tickets. Over the last several years we have seen a decrease in the number of tickets written. Eight years ago we were at 150,000 and we are down to 80,000 annually.
Mr. Brooks asked what are the impacts to CASA?
Mr. Squires answered we are hoping they will pass the change and refund it. Court security will be another big impact. We receive in excess of $1.2 million annually and we hope it is reinstated. There are so many moving parts, so many interests being represented and that is why they created the sunset date in 18 months.
Mr. Sepulveda stated there will be major changes to the tickets written by the Illinois State Police. Currently, any tickets written in Will County by the ISP the fine comes to the County. Going forward that money will go to the state.
Mr. Moustis asked what do the fees fund in the Circuit Clerk’s office? Primarily, the fees are for automation and employees.
Mr. Sepulveda replied there is a set fee of $15 for automation.
Mr. Moustis asked what specifically goes to the Clerk’s Office?
Mr. Squires responded nothing is retained by us, everything is turned over to the county. There are special funds limited to what they can be used for. Even the special funds are subject to the budget review process. The special funds include automation, document storage, Clerk’s administration and operations.
Mr. Moustis stated the Committee and Board should know specifically how every office is impacted. You are impacted in the form of automation and document storage. The Sheriff’s Department may be impacted because it will cut their security. It will impact CASA and Children’s Advocacy. Who is impacted? How and how much? Those people below the poverty line who are fined $300 for a ticket, it is unfair. Those people never pay and go into a cycle of having their license suspended for not paying and then ticketed for driving on a suspended license. This is not necessarily a bad thing. The fees were getting out of hand. This may alter the revenue streams the overall reform of the system is good.
Mr. Sepulveda stated the fees paid to the court are user fees. It is not like taxes that go across the board, this is due to an action.
Mr. Squires stated when I started here 19 years a ticket was $75 and now its $300. I think the State put in a lot of specific fees not totally related as the fees began going in different areas. This gives more uniformity and clarity on the fees for everyone. I think it will have a detrimental impact on our revenues.
A brief discussion took place regarding the changes allowing the fines for tickets written in Will County by the State Police to go to the State of Illinois.
Awarding Bid for Body Armor for Sheriff's Department
(Rita Weiss/Kevin Lynn)
Ms. Weiss reviewed the bids.
Mr. Marcum asked how often are the vest replaced? Ms. Weiss answered every five years.
Mrs. Dollinger stated the amount of this contract is $61,000. Will that be the amount for the next three years?
Ms. Weiss replied yes, and they are allowed up to a 5% increased based on the manufacturer’s increases.
Mrs. Dollinger asked was the $61,000 in the Sheriff’s budget for this year?
Ms. Weiss responded yes, he budgets every year for this.
RESULT: MOVED FORWARD [UNANIMOUS]
TO: Will County Board
MOVER: Mimi Cowan, Member
SECONDER: Gloria Dollinger, Member
AYES: Marcum, Brooks Jr., Cowan, Dollinger, Ventura, Weigel
ABSENT: Kraulidis
VII. OTHER NEW BUSINESS
VIII. PUBLIC COMMENT
https://willcountyil.iqm2.com/Citizens/FileOpen.aspx?Type=12&ID=3319&Inline=True
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